Judging by the gif Reid just shared, I think Dan goes back to work for TV.
To be clear, I apologise profusely for putting this out into the universe.
But at this point the writing for Amy, and their relationship, has become so mean-spirited, that I’m half expecting Dan to knock up some twenty-year old at the convention, decide it’s time to settle down, and marry her. Knowing him, he’d probably ask Amy for congratulations.
This would be especially fitting if he gets it into his head to be a political candidate, which wouldn’t totally stun me. He’s telegenic and charming, after all, though less than he used to be, and experienced – there’s got to be some upstate New York district that would take him on as a ringer. And wouldn’t a pretty young wife and baby be the ideal accessories for an up and coming congressman?
Obviously, I don’t want this to happen, because they’ll never let Amy react to it the way she should – by burning down his house – so it would just be one last instalment of Amy-torture. But given the casting spoilers…
To answer your specific question, I can’t help but suspect that, like all of Dan’s flashes of awareness, this one will last no more than a few minutes before he doubles down on whatever he was doing before – so I don’t know that I’d expect a shift back to TV. That said, he certainly hasn’t covered himself in glory as a political staffer in a long time (I will forever mourn the possibility to seeing him destroy Danny Chung), so it’s definitely possible.
I know both AC and RS implied there's at least some closure for Dan/Amy but I just don't see how it's possible. S7 has made it clear that Dan's one of the worst people on earth so there's no way to turn around and have him "set her free" (he's too selfish or doesn't care enough for that) but even marrying them off in the finale to characters we don't really know doesn't do it either b/c it'll be hard to believe either of them is that invested (esp. Dan obvi) that their status quo is threatened.
This has been my concern with the ending for a while now. Because their relationship has been so dominant for both of them – it’s basically the only functional (admittedly that’s a relative term) Dan appears to have.
It was why I always thought putting them together was the only ending where they wouldn’t wind up destroying each other (if only by implication). I could believe that Dan would make a cost-benefit calculation that his time as a relentless slut has an expiry date and that compromising a little would be worth to keep Amy around – that seems the kind of fundamentally selfish thought process that would come naturally to him.
But Dan being selfless enough to tolerate Amy being visibly more attracted to another man than she is to him, seems like an enormous leap. Sure, he doesn’t want to be with Amy himself, but that doesn’t mean he would ever accept her preferring someone else. (And if the show tries to sell us on that, I quit). He likes having her on a string – to hang out with and tease and make goo-goo eyes at – far too much for that. (This is probably what Reid Scott was talking about when he said Dan had held her back).
And yeah, if he does end up married to someone else and we’re supposed to believe he actually loves this woman (but not Amy), I think the show will have officially jumped the shark. No way that’s true.
All of which means that the only I can see it working out in a not miserable fashion is if Amy puts an end to it. She’s capable of that, and Dan never has been.
The problem is, to demonstrate that to the audience, there needs to be a moment where Amy categorically rejects Dan and commits to something/someone else. It doesn’t need to be a big moment (they built her relationship with Buddy in all of three scenes remember) but it does have to happen. Because there is no way she could be in a functional relationship with someone else if Dan is still swallowing up her attention in the way he always has – no one with self-respect would tolerate their partner being engrossed with someone else the way Amy has been with Dan.
And it would certainly be karmically fitting if Dan didn’t actually realise it had happened until fifteen years down the line or something, when it finally dawns on him just what he gave up and how little he got for the sacrifice.
But since Anna Chlumsky said there’s no comeuppance for Dan, and Reid Scott said the season ends with a win for him…I am very, very dubious that they’ll give us that much. And I find the idea of Amy’s constant heartbreak persisting into the future quite depressing.
Playing this out the way the audience expected would have been so much more fun to watch, it’s a real shame they went the way they did.
As always though, I would be so happy to be wrong on this one.
God I want amy to be pregnant at the end of this season but I just don’t want to get my hopes up. I mean all we have to go on is that picture of her in the white dress and that could be nothing!
I go round and round on this, because…I never suggested the possibility because it was something I wanted to happen. It just seemed like a natural way to round out the arc.
And I think I’m going to be really uncomfortable with it, if Amy is pregnant and the baby is Dan’s. Because it feels like it would be doing serious violence to Amy’s character for her to sleep with him again at this point – especially to sleep with him in a scenario where she’s risking another pregnancy.
But then I try to get my head around a scenario where Amy meets someone else, has a baby, starts a happy relationship with him, and Dan doesn’t insert himself inappropriately into the dynamic in order to reclaim her attention, and I just can’t do it. That would require a degree of emotional maturity that neither of them have ever demonstrated, and I don’t see them growing that much in three episodes. Amy having someone else’s baby – when she didn’t have Dan’s – seems exactly the kind of scenario that would send his possessive instincts into overdrive.
And if the baby is Dan’s, but they aren’t together – well that was always my nightmare scenario, because no way Dan doesn’t manipulate that set-up to his benefit at every opportunity, and the thought of Amy and a child being emotionally tormented in perpetuity is really, really depressing.
Of course, Amy might not be pregnant at the end of the show. In which case, Veep will have told the story of a woman being emotionally battered into having an abortion she didn’t really want by her long-term love interest, and never getting a second chance at having a family.
In case you’re wondering, this is why I’m concerned about the ending – because it feels to me like all the options will leave a bad taste in one way or another. (Option one is probably the least upsetting from that perspective, but requires us to ignore six seasons of Dan being a possessive shit to work – so it’s not exactly great from a writing standpoint).
I don’t even care if Amy and Dan get together because it doesn’t look like they will. But do you think there will be a kiss this season?
I’m not going to bet on it, with the way the writers have been playing things.
That said, I could definitely see Dan kissing Amy in a moment of victory – which seems a likely possibility – and only then finding out that she’s seeing someone / pregnant / whatever. It would be giving the characters (and the audience) a “moment” at the point in time when the romantic door between them is well and truly closed.
Or Amy will end the series still pining for Dan and being variously abused by him, because that’s super funny.
I freely admit I don’t have the clearest sense of why the writers are doing what they’re doing – so many of their choices go precisely against my dramatic instincts, that my predictions maybe aren’t worth much at this point.
We’re complaining so much about the writing and the changes mandel has made and we have the right to but I think ultimately, the craziness of the show is something they had to do. For years, even in s6, it was easy for the show to avoid being insane because politics irl used to be, for lack of a better word, timid. Now with trump doing something more and more insane everyday, the veep writers have found it difficult to make the show something different to that.
I understand where you’re coming from and I can see how much of a challenge it was for the writers, given everything that is happening in real life. But after everything we’ve seen this season, I wish they would have ended it at season 6 instead of trying to contend with it.
I’m sure there was still a way to comment on real life politics without distorting the characters and essence of the show, and resorting to direct parallels and nihilism. However, I’m not a writer, so maybe there wasn’t. And in terms of how else they could have done it differently, I’m not sure.
@thebookofmaev is really good with characterization, narrative structure, etc. so I’m going to tag her in this to get her opinion on: 1. Whether or not they could have avoided going in the direction they’re heading in and 2. How else they could have tackled the current administration and real life politics in a way that was much more satisfying.
Do you think after being taken down a few notches by Selina, we are going to see Dan more like his old self? As in, more wheeling and dealing and teaming up with Amy, and less sleeping around. Or do you think there’s really little to no learning this season and this won’t change his behavior at all?
I feel like I’m over-using this gif lately, but:
To give you a slightly more useful answer. Going by standard dramatic logic, that is exactly what I would expect to happen. Because the most frustrating aspect of Dan as a character has always been…he could have everything he wants if he would just get out of his own way.
Taking the show as a whole, there really are only two things Dan genuinely wants – success, and to have Amy with him (platonically or otherwise). Time and time again he comes back to those desires – and if the next episode is him exploiting Richard to somehow weasel his way onto Jonah’s campaign (I have no idea how that would work, by the way, but it’s what I am expecting – maybe Dan arranges for an official endorsement?), then I think we can safely assume that those same desires are still driving him.
So, one would usually expect that, having crashed and burned so horribly – having slept around so much he drove Amy away and got fired, again – he might, at long last, take stock, and think about how to ensure he can get what he wants and keep it for longer than thirty seconds. His sex life has definitely become disruptive enough that he should.
Because, while Amy may have wanted a child, that really doesn’t mean the two of them have to settle down in suburban domesticity forever more. Given the resources available to them – and Dan at least must have some serious money, whatever about Amy – there would definitely be ways they could adapt their living situation into one that works for them.
I know I keep saying this but…Dan is not dumb. Callous, self-involved and emotionally stunted, but not stupid. So, under normal circumstances I really would expect the shape of the arc to be that he puts two and two together, realises that the happiest he’s ever been was in those moments when Amy found the courage to confide in him and trust him, when she relied on him as a partner in crime and stared at him like he was the sexiest man in earth, and decide that to hell with this, he needs to win her back – and be Communications Director for the biggest political upset campaign in history. It’s a win-win, and would be even if they lose… because he always feels most like Dan Egan when seeing himself through Amy’s eyes. (Whether I would be able to accept that arc after the fuckery of 7.01-3 is another matter entirely, of course, but I am just describing what I think the shape of it would be).
And then the two of them join forces in the final episode and set forth into the future as the most terrifying and dysfunctional political power couple since Antony and Cleopatra.
The show is really doubling-down on the notion of futile stupidity. The first three episodes seemed to surgically remove the small part of Dan that looked like decency – and 7.04 showed Amy sacrificing what remains of her conscience and sinking into the same nihilism that is eating the rest of the show.
And going by the interview @wecouldstillbegreat just posted, the show is only going to get bigger and broader (alas).
So, as much as I struggle with the idea that Dan can be that fucking dumb that he wouldn’t realise something in his life has to change, this is not, at this point, a show about smart people. (I can accept Dan being callous and selfish and even cruel – those are all well established traits – it’s Dan being stupid that makes me crazy).
Basically, if Dan doesn’t change – at least a little – at this point, it’s going to feel like the show has purposefully hobbled him. (I’ve always said he should see Selina as a terrible, terrible warning for what his future could like – if I can see that, surely he can).
But I would be so happy to be wrong on this one. The show losing its brain is more upsetting to me than any individual character decision.
YIKES I sure hope they're not going to go the route of making Selina like… the fictional Trump in this universe. I always thought if that comparison were made it would go to Jonah (buffoonery, lack of real experience, sheer entitled asshole-ish ness). But from the sounds of it Selina's actions and political stances are…worrying.
I think that’s exactly what we’re getting – I think they’re both Trump in this story. Jonah by dint of sheer personality, inexperience and total unsuitability for the position (though at least two of those apply to Selina), and Selina by her willingness to collaborate with a foreign power to steal an election.
I mean, I’ve been saying all along that we were going to get President/VP Jonah Ryan, but the thought that he might be the only one with a legitimate right to be there – because by whipping up xenophobia and chauvinism he got out the vote – is pretty tough to stomach. I’m not particularly enjoying all the ripped from the headlines stuff this year – they end up in a strange place where they’re not as absurd as reality, and they’re also soft-peddling Trump by splitting his traits between two different people (somewhat questionably, at least in Selina’s case).
I think we can be pretty certain that – whatever repercussions Selina’s choices have – Dan and Amy are clear, since they both left the campaign before the really shady shit started. Richard seems likely to bumble his way into something major by the end of the series, as they were setting him up as a kind of Nice Rudy Guiliani – though I’m not sure what that might be. It seems like Gary is possibly being set up to be Selina’s fall guy – and I’m thinking Mike will break the story (without realising it himself) that brings her down, which will drive Leon crazy.
In which case Selina will end the season without any of her original team around her – a major blow, as emotionally attached to them as she has been, if only as targets for abuse. If she does have power it will be a hollow victory for her – especially if she knows that Jonah beat her in the real contest.
If the last joke is “Did the President call?” I will throw up a leg – because dear lord it is an obvious gag for them to go for.
It’s concerning how much I want Amy to date Jonah’s Secret Service guy
You and me both, anon. Especially as…remember I talked about someone who could emasculate Dan? Who better than a Secret Service agent, who probably knows eleven different ways to kill you with a fork, including two that won’t get any blood on the floor?
Amy’s consistent emiseration has made me very invested in her happiness – which is something I should probably get over, given the show we’re dealing with. Dan and Selina – literal toxic waste dumps of people – can’t go three feet without getting laid, and Amy, who is smart, driven, beautiful and honestly wanting someone she can care about, gets whacked in the face every time she dares to express a romantic or sexual desire.
The injustice of it is terrible. Even Catherine has more personal happiness than Amy does – even Jonah seems to have more people who care about him.
So, yeah, Tall Dark and Nice to Amy cannot show up quick enough as far as I’m concerned.
I officially hate Selina with a passion – do you think there's any hope of her getting a miserable ending – it seems like she's doing well in primaries so far…
Basic rule of writing – if they’re flying high in the middle of the story, they will not be at the end. That’s boring – there’s no suspense, no tension, no shift of mood.
So, Selina may be doing well now, but I think we can be pretty certain that it’s not going to last, and a reversal of fortune is just around the corner.
But guys, let’s make sure we’re hating Selina for the right reasons. As much as I think it is world-endingly-dumb for her to sleep with Dan – and I do – I don’t find this anywhere near as upsetting as pressuring Amy to get an abortion. I highly doubt that Selina did this with the intent of hurting Amy, or that she plans on Amy finding out about it. As coldly as she fired Dan, I don’t think she wants anyone to know.
Dan is not Amy’s exclusive property. As long as he has the decency and tact to keep his sexual exploits well the fuck away from her (which seems to be asking a lot in this show, since he can’t keep his dick out of her family members), instead of rubbing them in her face when he knows that upsets her, I truly don’t give a damn who he sleeps with.
Besides, always worth remembering – no fate could be as bad as being Dan or Selina, especially not with their magnificent ability to drive away the people who care about them.